I'm doing a lot of second guessing.

[bald9eagle]

It's just normal for me but I have found myself questioning everything about my hunting area. Will there be outfitters? Will there be guys coming from other directions? Will the elk even be there? Where do I go if I can't find any in the area?

Someone please tell me it will be alright.

[Gypsumreaper]

Second guessing I've learned is part of the game I'm always thinking shoulda went over there instead. Honestly you're gonna second guess urself anywhere cause you are chasing a living breathing creature one day there the next gone. Idk how many times I have been told about an animal just 5 minutes up the trail to get there and there's nothing. I do it at ice fishing tournaments as well. It's part of being human imo, you are never really sure in an area until that arrow or bullet has connected with an animal. Others may say different but I believe hunting is 10% skill, 15% preparation and 75% luck. You may be the best hunter in the world but doesn't mean ur gonna kill every single time, (especially in OTC units) you can scout all summer and prepare all summer but you're chasing an animal that does its own thing. It's all about right place, right time, right calls, right shooting lane, right wind, there's so many uncontrollable factors to hunting that it's not a 100% game. You can have a bull use the same trail every day, for 3 months at the same time and the day you get in there he goes a different way you never know. It's like a sixth sense ever decided to do something out of it normal routine to find out that maybe the commute you usually take had a bad accident. And if you would have went that way you would have been in the middle of it all. Sometimes you do something by a gut feeling and I think animals can do that to. Go with what ya know and if it doesn't work out just have a backup plan. If there's an outfitter then move a ridge over. A lot of other hunters have a spot mapped that you think is an escape route. If there's no elk have a backup of where they could go away from pressure. Just have plan A,B,C,D,E and F.


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[mongopino915]

Second guessing is what kept us heading into them elk country because we never know what to expect.

[cohunter14]

As has been said, second guessing happens to us all. Figure out what your gut and your head are telling you and go with that. There is no wrong choice if you go with that and commit to it. You can always change plans and hunt elsewhere later in the day or the next day or the day after that.

[Indian Summer]

There may be an outfitter out there somewhere. But if you had ever guided and tried to get a client moving in the morning and then to climb hills with a backpack on you wouldn't worry about them. It can't hurt to call the Forest Service and ask where they are so you can be sure not to cause them or yourself any issues.

As far as other hunters.... First know that 90% of them are just going for a walk. The rest will get somewhere but when it comes to committing to dropping down into somewhere that nobody wants to pack an elk out of you'll lose half of the other 10%. I don't care if there are 10 trucks at the trailhead when I get there because I know that the real competition is few and far between.

So make a phone call or 2 if you need to but once you are there there's no need to second guess anything because you Grasshopper, are an Elk Nut!

[Gypsumreaper]

Hahaha I like what Indian Summer said, yes outfitters may be out there but usually by day 2-3 the clients are pretty burnt out, remember a guide is doing this stuff all season they are used to riding horses, hiking and working in the hills, but clients not so much. We do get a few guys every year that actually go out and train and prepare for the hunt and they do ok depending how intense they got. But they still usually go from low elevation to high and it takes a toll. And as said most guys are just out walking around not many get in deep and go hard. We spike camp a lot when I'm not guiding and I'm with friends it gets us that much further in front of the trailhead guys.


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[Mathewsz7-elkridge]

I second guess my self on the regular. It's just part of the game I think. Wanting to be successful and a smooth hunt with minor hiccups just adds to it. If you get any answers about outfitter from forest services let me know because they said they didn't have any information to me. I just keep telling myself I will get there hear my first bugle and it will be game on! If I don't it will be on to the next plan.

[TurkeyBowMaster]

I wouldn't want any competition, but outfitters probably are not any more of a threat than other hunters. You should be able to outperform an outfitter shackled to an out of shape client. Just hunt hard and don't quit. You might find a spot where the extra pressure will push elk to you.

[Gypsumreaper]

Hahaha you should see me sometimes turkeybowmaster I was 21 guiding 40+ guys not that 40+ is super old but they never did much for conditioning before coming from the east coast. I constantly got asked where the tree stand was and a few times got a talking to from the boss for going to hard, hiking to much all that. Finally 2nd rifle had a kid come out with his dad he was well conditioned from summer softball and ran every morning. Or so he thought boss told me k bud this kids 24, he's well conditioned and he told me that he could out hike any guide I had, and if one of my guides could wear him out by the end of the week, he would come back the next year with 5 of his buddies for another hunt. So I was given strict instructions to ride the horses to this gulch and hike every bit of it as I could find the kid his elk of course not just wear the kid out. So first day I took it easy wanted him to get a little acclimated and he did pretty good. Boss asked how it went I told him and he said ok good tomorrow is go time. We were riding out of camp at 3:30 for a 4 hour ride hit the furthest gulch in the permit. And I ran the kid through the wringer, to the top of the mountain over around down. Bout lunch time we sat down and made a plan, he told me he was feeling great and I hadn't even worked him yet. So I told him ok bud well I've been going easy lets get on some elk and I'll show ya what elk hunting is all about. I started glassing and found a really nice bull about 3 ridges over, he looked them over said he wanted him and after a quick call to the boss giving him the plan and asking him to pick up my horses when he came through we'd call if we killed one otherwise hike back to camp and we were off. The kid told me that he wanted over there as quick as possible and not to hold back, I said alright bud here's the radio if you can't keep up you can call the boss I'll see ya over there. Well he ended up bogging down real bad coming up over the first ridge I seen him crest it as I was sitting on top of the second ridge watchin the bull get up and stretch. He finally made it to me we didn't get a shot at the bull cause he created the ridge headed away from us but I had to call the boss and see where he was for my horses cause the kid was beat. The boss knew that he wouldn't hack it with me so he was waiting on the trail on the ridge below us. Kid finally admitted at camp that he was wrong and I got the nickname the mountain goat after that, he said I've never seen someone be able to hike like that not stopping and just going til I got where I wanted to be. He ended up killing a really nice bull, but wasn't a ton of hiking for him after day 2 and the next year kept his promise and brought his buddies out. I didn't guide that next year and he said he was a little sad cause his buddies all wanted to take a shot at breakin me. But they had my younger brother guiding them and he broke them, he laughed at them and said that if I was there they wouldn't have lasted nearly as long as he barely keeps up with me


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[bald9eagle]

I'm 41 with heart problems and three stents in place. This should be a breeze. Lol.

[bald9eagle]

I've called the CPW and he didn't even know where I was asking about. I called one outfitter wanting to ask about hauling out and if he had any camps in the area. He hasn't returned my call yet.

One drainage I feel good about. The access from the other side is limited plus I'll be on top of it so anyone coming in from the bottom will push elk up and over. The other drainage appears to have easier access but it is 3 miles to the area that I feel like the elk will be in.

I kinda felt like the word "crowded" was a relative term. Crowded because there are several trucks at the trailhead or crowded because you saw several folks 3 miles in? I never really thought about that with the outfitter clients. No offense to anyone (and I don't think I will since most of you guys are true elk hunters) but I can see how you might call outfitter clients "lazy". They can afford to take it easier so they do. Not that there is anything wrong with that type of hunting but I can see a certain personality taking that route. You go with an outfitter for two reasons. You are wanting the "easier" way or you are a little insecure about going completely DIY. I would say that most outfitter clients are one and done guys that are just marking things off the bucket list. I could be totally naïve about that too. My apologies if I offend anyone.

[CurlyTail]

You should in fact have a plan B, and a plan C in case your worse fears are true.

There is only so much you can do preseason scouting, and you will not really know an area until you have boots on the ground - during the season you plan to hunt.

You must adjust your expectations for your first season for this reason. If you have selected the greatest spot, with no competition, on your first try - count yourself lucky indeed.

Be aware, that this is huge country that you are venturing into, and there is plenty of room to get isolated. Not doubt, at the end of the season, you will have learned alot, and will be able to fine tune your plan for next season.

You will have an absolute blast, even if you do not harvest, and your trip will be more than worthwhile.

Call the National Forest Office, not the CPW. All outfitters must be licensed with the National Forest and they have a map with all the outfitters, and their camp locations

[BRazz]

This post is exactly what I was thinking about over the weekend! I'm getting everything prepped for my season, and thinking about how I really haven't found tons of fresh elk sign where I'm planning to go. So I start thinking about how the elk will likely move in there later in the season... but what about early season? Surely next week those elk will be where they've been all summer... and that's not my hunting spot...

I do this every year.

[njdoxie]

There may be an outfitter out there somewhere. But if you had ever guided and tried to get a client moving in the morning and then to climb hills with a backpack on you wouldn't worry about them. It can't hurt to call the Forest Service and ask where they are so you can be sure not to cause them or yourself any issues.

As far as other hunters.... First know that 90% of them are just going for a walk. The rest will get somewhere but when it comes to committing to dropping down into somewhere that nobody wants to pack an elk out of you'll lose half of the other 10%. I don't care if there are 10 trucks at the trailhead when I get there because I know that the real competition is few!

well said, I'm afraid I fall into that 10% who find elk in bad spots, and think better of pulling the trigger

[njdoxie]

Hahaha you should see me sometimes turkeybowmaster I was 21 guiding 40+ guys not that 40+ is super old but they never did much for conditioning before......

love the outfitter stories, keep 'em coming