Top 3 sounds to learn?

[Rizzy]

What would be the best first 3 Elk sounds to learn?

[WapitiTalk1]

Elknut1 lists the top 4 sounds that will get you well on your way in the Tips and Clips section. For 3 sounds, I'd recommend cow/calf (after all, that's what the boys of September are looking for), locator (gotta be able to get answers for the morning hunt from those night time ID, MT, WY, CO bugle points), and a nervous grunt to stop em in their tracks for a shot.

In addition to the 4th sound Elknut1 mentions (challenge bugle to get the dander up on old stinky), I would say don't sleep on merely raking a big fat stick on some unsuspecting alder and stomping your feet. That can do the trick as well as anything sometimes

[Glacier Country]

Here is an audio clip of the top 4 sounds to learn. Hope this helps----> Troy Glacier Country Hunting Calls

[ElkNut1]

If I had to boil it down to 3 sounds it would be Advertising Bugles--Nervous/Popping Grunt--Cow/Calf Talk!

Here's why! Advertising Bugles can vary & get quite creative in intensity & volume. Bulls use this sound when near cow groups with cows near the breeding stage. Using this sound as a locator can incite other bulls to sound off as they too represent themselves to cows in the area. This sound can spark bugling from other bulls very well, better than the pure note of a locator bugle.

Nervous/Popping Grunt stands on its own merits, it's truly the # 1 sound we use to put bulls on the ground in crunch time to seal the deal when in tight! This sound should be able to be made with ones voice, a mouth reed & a mouth reed & bugle, know all 3 ways & you'll be prepared for the unexpected!

Cow/Calf Talk. This means varying your tones, mews & whines to tailor your calling method! You will be able to imitate calf separation tones, nervous tones, pitchy,estrous tones, social talk & the like.

With these 3 sounds you will be well armed to put nearly any calling sequence together & be believable in your use! Throwing in timely raking depending on the encounter can really sell yourself at the right time!

ElkNut1

[twinkieman]

Here's why! Advertising Bugles can vary & get quite creative in intensity & volume. Bulls use this sound when near cow groups with cows near the breeding stage. Using this sound as a locator can incite other bulls to sound off as they too represent themselves to cows in the area. This sound can spark bugling from other bulls very well, better than the pure note of a locator bugle.

In the Tips and Clips, You didn't mention the advertising bugle, has more experience with this particular bugle changed your opinion? The reason you state above makes sense, and the reason I ask the question is my desire to learn as much as I can. Look forward to your response.

[Toby]

Can you describe the advertising bugle?

[WapitiTalk1]

There's a whole lotta advertising going on in this clip .

[Toby]

Thanks Phantom, perfect.

[Rizzy]

Well good, those are the three I'm getting more proficient at....sort of. I didn't know the difference between the locator bugle and advertising bugle. I guess the locator Bugle is the one I'm hearing in mid to late October for the rifle season? Does the advertising bugle have a tenancy to bring more cows in?

[ElkNut1]

Rory, perfect clip sir, thanks! As you can see most those bugles are bulls advertising themselves to the cow or cows that are in or nearing estrus! It's also noteworthy that at this stage these bulls are more concerned with out bugling one another than fighting! Since it's the cows that choose the more dominant bulls for possible breeding, these bulls are representing this feature through their bugles! It's up to the cows to choose who best suits them as they are ready to be bred. Of course Challenges can come up as bulls force the action to get closer to these hot cows!

Marc, a lot depends on the phrasing for the day when I'm writing things such as in the Tips & Tactics Forum. As you may have noticed I have the Location & Advertising Bugle on the same thought on page 7 in the PlayBook. There's a little difference between the two, I'll explain. The Location Bugle is generally used by bulls when "In Search Of" other elk especially cows. A lot depends on their testosterone levels as to how wound up they are that day! A classic Location bugle is used every couple of minutes to once every 15 min to 30 minutes apart & in many cases these bulls are on the move covering ground in search of elk groups! The intensity level of these bugles on a scale of 1 to 10 is 2-3 at best.

However, an Advertising Bugle used by bulls denotes cows in the area, hot cows! This is where you can come across multiple bulls trying to out bugle one another hoping the cows consider them as possible breeders. These Advertising Bugles are much more frequent, as close as seconds apart & generally not over a minute apart for quite some time! On a scale of 1- to 10 their intensity level is 8-10. They are pretty pretty wound up & testosterone levels are high! This is the type of bugling I use in the Breeding Sequence, it's the perfect sound for that method! As you can see in the clip bulls can get quite creative in their calling attributes, we can do the same, lose the pure notes & get down to raw business with anything from lip bawls to groans, moans, glunks, bulls cow calling & following up with a short scream etc! --- When you listen to the Sounds By The Elk CD you will notice some of the titles as Bulls Calling Cows, Bulls Calling Cows from a herd bull, Bulls Cow Calling then bugling & so on, all these are a form of Advertising Bugles! The # 1 thing to look for is Intensity & Frequency of these bugles & you can easily tell them apart from a simple Location Bugle! Please feel to elaborate on this or ask further questions! Thanks!

ElkNut1

[twinkieman]

thanks for all the info Paul

[Toby]

This is a great thread.

Could any of the bugles in the clip that aren't followed by chuckles be considered challenge bugles?

[ElkNut1]

Toby, some are borderline for sure but for the most part those bugles not followed by chuckling are Advertising or come over here bugles to the cow/cows they hear or smell. Those bulls were doing their best to represent dominance as possible breeder bulls, that clip is rutting at its best, those are the days in the elkwoods you wish would never end! (grin)

ElkNut1

[twinkieman]

Paul,
Care to elaborate more on the breeding sequence at this time?

[foxvalley]

I think one of the most important sounds to make, and I think a very easy one at that, is the nervous or popping grunt.I use this sound to STOP THE BULL! before I shoot. This sound will stop him in his tracks,and I used this to stop the last two bulls I killed. Bad things can happen real fast shooting at a moving bull,most of which involve branches,and this cost me one of the biggest bulls that i had called in ever. I had him dead to rights at 18 yards as he walked by me broadside,and following him with my site,I shot, and hit a branch about a foot in front of my arrow,and didn't even come close to hitting him.You just can't see whats comming into your line of fire. I do this sound just with my voice in case I don't have a diaphram in. Up your odds and stop him!

[ElkNut1]

foxvalley, you bet, it's the "killing sound" (grin) It's the last one they hear!

Marc, sure thing! We use this sequence in it's infancy so to speak, this means before other satellites are aware there are cows coming into estrus in the area we are calling in. This sound can be used in pre-rut--peak-rut-- or post rut. In its infancy as the herd bull realizes by smell that he has a cow approaching estrus he can get quite vocal in his courting her & watching her closely so as not to be far from him. If she wanders far & she does constantly he will do his best to coral her with sounds such as groans, moans, lip bawls , glunking, short urgent one pitch bugles, raking/stomping. At this time this cow as well as others in the group can get quite chatty. We will carry on with this sequence for a good 30 minutes. With all this happening it attracts other bulls in the area to their position as they too have the same urges as the herd bull so they want to be part of the action. -- These satellites can bugle now & then on their approach & search or use other bull sounds as they to yearn for these hot cows. But, they generally come in silent so it's very important to keep a close eye & ear out as they can show like a ghost out of nowhere!

ElkNut1