Pardon me sir, what did you say?

[WapitiTalk1]

This guy obviously just had a refreshing mud spa, and, is enjoying a crisp salad. What's all the noise about? Do you think the bugles by the big guy are:

a. Locator bugles?
b. Advertising bugles?
c. Challenge/warning bugles?
d. Screams to gather/move his cows out bugles?
d. Something other than what is mentioned above?

Bonus question: What time of year do you think this footage was filmed? Winner gets a bag of Cheetos

[Glacier Country]

I will let someone else answer this. I am going to try to mimic him With the Watermelon diaphragm call . He just sounds really cool.

[Relentlessly Unforgiving]

B advertising. Looks like prerut activity during the first week of September.

[Jpulle1]

I have minimal experience but will say he is responding with a warning.
Mid september.

[elkaholic]

Advertising bugles. First or second week of sept.

[flystrait]

By watching his body language and the sounds he was making, he was directing towards the other bulls not any cows IMO. I believe it was more of a warning, he might have a couple cows nearby. He was not going anywhere and had his ground set. It looks like the middle of Sept to me based on the other bulls sounds and the wallowing he was doing. If i was to try and call this bull in for a shot, I would get as close a possible and challenge him with the same sounds that Troy posted adding a few grunts on the end. I bet he answers me before I finish my bugle and comes right in. Just my 2cents

Craig

[zpd307]

he has some growl to his bugle, I say a warning.

[westaner]

He's got no cows , just wallowed, and feeding.
He's casually advertising , the other bull has cows , and screamed and huffed a warning.
This bull will easily come to cow calls!

[BrentLaBere]

That sounded awesome, Troy.
Its hard to say for sure....we dont get the whole picture with or without the cows (visually speaking). But, I would have to say advertising and early September. Bulls are now in "their" territory and the heat of the rut is near. Cows are in the area but not with any particular bull yet. Maybe one hot one to get all of them fired up, and then another, and another, all knowing the time is near.

[Wyo67]

I'd say he's just advertising his availability during lunch... My guess for time frame would be between Aug 20-31st.

[idahoghost]

I'd have to agree with everyone else. Advertising bugle. I would be guessing as well, later part of August. But then again, if I knew, just maybe, I would have shot one by now....

[Trophyhill]

I'm thinking advertising bugle last week of September for the bag of Cheetos

[flystrait]

What in his bugle is giving the impression of advertising and having no cow's? Is it his tone, growl, or lipball? Or just body posture? What are your thoughts.

BTW I'm sure I could call him in with a cow call as well, I just trust my bugle based on my experience.

Craig

[Wyo67]

What in his bugle is giving the impression of advertising and having no cow's? Is it his tone, growl, or lipball? Or just body posture? What are your thoughts.

BTW I'm sure I could call him in with a cow call as well, I just trust my bugle based on my experience.

Craig

It's that he doesn't have cows with him that leads me towards the advertising side. He's at ease feeding and just wallowed, so I think he's hollarin' out there just to try and bring in an unattached cow or two. If he would have thrown some chuckles at the end of one or more of his bugles, then I would be thinking he's got cows nearby and is letting them know where he's at to keep them rounded up. By the same token, he's not aggressively growling or grunting, so I don't think he's putting on a show trying to drive off another bull.

[Trumkin the Dwarf]

This is just my take, and I am no expert, but this bull seems too relaxed to either have cows, or need cows just yet. I say Early September, and advertising bugles. More than anything I am going off the lack of growling, and the body lingo.

[BrentLaBere]

Sound alone, its confusing for me, but with the visual aid of him eating says to me he doesn't have cows. Does any bull or buck stop for a snack while being threatened of his manhood? I wouldn't think so..
I think cow calls or a bugle would work....not sure what I would use though. If it is early September like I guessed, I have used the nasally "estrus buzz" with success in a situation similar to this.

[Trophyhill]

What in his bugle is giving the impression of advertising and having no cow's? Is it his tone, growl, or lipball? Or just body posture? What are your thoughts.

BTW I'm sure I could call him in with a cow call as well, I just trust my bugle based on my experience.

Craig

I'll take a stab at that. I think he's a frustrated young bull who may have had cows earlier in the rut and lost them. The 2 different shades of his antlers (unless my iPhone is acting up again) lead me to believe its later in the rut. I think this bull would readily come to the sweet sound of cow in estrus of course reading the situation is something I'm working on

[flystrait]

Great input from all.

From my experience I have seen herd bulls act this way with a whole harem of cows near by, especially where the can see a ways. They did not feel a threat from me or another bull unless the distance closed and closed fast where the could not see the intruder. Could this bull be without cows? Very possible could he be advertising against the other bull with cows? I don't believe so, I did not hear any chuckles, there was no urgency from him to move toward the other elk etc. Could he be in a screaming match across the room saying screw you to while drinking a beer and chewing on peanuts? I think so, until the other guy starts coming across the room at you why would you go to him? Just some thoughts.. This is a great thread and very educational thanks for posting RJ. Remember everyone needs to eat, sleep and drink regardless of the time of year don't let that fool you.

[BrentLaBere]

Great input from all.

From my experience I have seen herd bulls act this way with a whole harem of cows near by, especially where the can see a ways. They did not feel a threat from me or another bull unless the distance closed and closed fast where the could not see the intruder. Could this bull be without cows? Very possible could he be advertising against the other bull with cows? I don't believe so, I did not hear any chuckles, there was no urgency from him to move toward the other elk etc. Could he be in a screaming match across the room saying screw you to while drinking a beer and chewing on peanuts? I think so, until the other guy starts coming across the room at you why would you go to him? Just some thoughts.. This is a great thread and very educational thanks for posting RJ. Remember everyone needs to eat, sleep and drink regardless of the time of year don't let that fool you.

So this bull may be displaying dominance, not advertising to cows that aren't there. Gets a little hazy for me here. This is where we can go back to the intensity of his calls. Is a bull more urgent when he has cows and is in a shouting match or when he is looking for them? I am not able to pick up on these subtleties just yet.....
Lets say this bull has a harem, or just a couple of cows, what is your move? Seems as though a bugle has to be pulled out with a challenge and possibly displaying (raking and stomping) in close to threaten him. No reason to leave his cows for another, right? Tough for me to say which one I would go with, but after discussion and the ability to break it down, I would have to go with my bugle. I know we have discussed this before in other threads. If a bull answers your cow sounds, stick to the cow sounds. In this spot, I haven't called to this bull, they are simply sounding off all around me and I find myself closing in on this dirty guy. Bulls are sounding off, I am pulling out my bugle and throwing my best one at it him, with emotion. I feel I am up to that level with learning from these threads on here and my calling, learning from Troy( and Craig) with Glacier Country calls.

Another interesting thought on feeding and water. I know they will sacrifice it during these times, but to what extent I am not sure of. Depends on the threat I suppose.

Now, If my co-workers wouldnt mind me practicing some bugles this morning

[WapitiTalk1]

I figured this would be a good VID to discuss because of the unknowns . I’m not sure if this guy has cows for certain, but I’m thinking he just might. The distant bull(s) pose no immediate, close quarter’s threat, so the meadow bull is responding to them with a “your mama wears Army boots” insult and warning. Perhaps he decided to leave the bedding area and head to a nearby spot for a quick spit bath, drink, and a garden salad w/house dressing while his cows flick flies/chew their cuds in the nearby timber. As flystrait mentioned, they still eat and drink during the rut as time permits. I sat across an alder choked draw from a very nice 6 PT in Idaho two years ago and watched him for several hours in the middle of the afternoon. He would bed for a while, get up, feed a bit, and bugle a warning back at any other bull he heard in the distance, and then, bed back down for a while. He never came unglued or left the general area of where we figured his girls may be. When it was finally time for the group to get up and move, we could see he had 5 or 6 cows that were hidden very well in the alder. His bugle tone and length were very similar to this guys sound and would answer distant intruder’s calls (including one from me) almost immediately but again, would not react with anything more than a warning to stay away. Could the bull in the VID have been solo? Perhaps but those are no locators, and, IMO… are a bit too emotion packed for general advertising. Just my thoughts on the clip. Oh, I’m guessing time frame is probably early to mid SEPT (actively wallowing, the rut is kicking into second gear, and I’m guessing much of the herding up has occurred and pecking order has somewhat been established). Trophy, you can have the cheetos as I know you like them with a cold glass of beer

[flystrait]

Great input from all.

From my experience I have seen herd bulls act this way with a whole harem of cows near by, especially where the can see a ways. They did not feel a threat from me or another bull unless the distance closed and closed fast where the could not see the intruder. Could this bull be without cows? Very possible could he be advertising against the other bull with cows? I don't believe so, I did not hear any chuckles, there was no urgency from him to move toward the other elk etc. Could he be in a screaming match across the room saying screw you to while drinking a beer and chewing on peanuts? I think so, until the other guy starts coming across the room at you why would you go to him? Just some thoughts.. This is a great thread and very educational thanks for posting RJ. Remember everyone needs to eat, sleep and drink regardless of the time of year don't let that fool you.

So this bull may be displaying dominance, not advertising to cows that aren't there. Gets a little hazy for me here. This is where we can go back to the intensity of his calls. Is a bull more urgent when he has cows and is in a shouting match or when he is looking for them? I am not able to pick up on these subtleties just yet.....
Lets say this bull has a harem, or just a couple of cows, what is your move? Seems as though a bugle has to be pulled out with a challenge and possibly displaying (raking and stomping) in close to threaten him. No reason to leave his cows for another, right? Tough for me to say which one I would go with, but after discussion and the ability to break it down, I would have to go with my bugle. I know we have discussed this before in other threads. If a bull answers your cow sounds, stick to the cow sounds. In this spot, I haven't called to this bull, they are simply sounding off all around me and I find myself closing in on this dirty guy. Bulls are sounding off, I am pulling out my bugle and throwing my best one at it him, with emotion. I feel I am up to that level with learning from these threads on here and my calling, learning from Troy( and Craig) with Glacier Country calls.

Another interesting thought on feeding and water. I know they will sacrifice it during these times, but to what extent I am not sure of. Depends on the threat I suppose.

Now, If my co-workers wouldnt mind me practicing some bugles this morning

IMO you are going in the right direction Brent with this situation. My move is what I posted earlier get close and challenge him. Troy posted up sounds above that he would use to challenge him by as well.

RJ, great examples, paints a pretty clear picture.

[BrentLaBere]

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