What Did You Just Say To Me? Scenario 2

[WapitiTalk1]

Another “what did you just say to me” thread. Again, the disclaimer: I’m trying to be a descriptive as possible with the scenarios but please understand I can’t cover all the variables potentially encountered in each of the presented situations. For these threads, let’s assume everybody knows what the different elk noises sound like (cow chatter, locater bugle, screams, chuckles, grunts, alarm barks, nervous grunts, etc.). Remember, it’s all about sharing knowledge from experience, asking questions, and perhaps, learning a thing or two.

Scenario: its late afternoon, the third week in September and you find yourself on a hillside you hunted a few days before. The last time you were here, you’d received one answer to your locater bugle but no follow on action in that area. You believe it may be a transition area for elk between feed and bed. You have decided to stop short of a tiny finger ridge and throw out a few cow/calf calls to see if there may be anybody interested in joining you for dinner. You get close to the finger ridge, almost to the top so your calls can be heard in the alder bench on the other side, throw out some soft cow calls and immediately move backwards, off to one side of where you’d just called, 25 yards or so to set up. You hear what sounds like brush being bashed on the other side of the finger ridge. A few more cow calls by you, a bit more brush bashing coming from the other side of the little ridge. No bugles or cow calls come back at you from over the ridge, just the brush raking. You give this setup a good 10 minutes and continue to receive the same results. Finally, you decide to work the thermals and get a bit closer. As you crest the little finger ridge and are making your way uphill on an elk trail to gain the thermals advantage, you physically see alder moving below you to the left, about 75 yards. The elk perhaps heard you moving and is responding to what he perceives as the cow he heard? You move 20 to 30 yards more along the sidehill, above the bull and again, set up to do some soft cow sounds. Same response but this time you can see a young bull with pretty white antler tips knocking the snot out of some alder brush, and, pawing the ground. I’ll stop here. What is this elk communicating and what action, if any, should you take to potentially get a shot?

[Trophyhill]

I'll give it a shot. I think he's trying to tell that cow (you) that he's willing and able to breed. What should I as a hunter do? Hmmm. He's a young bull and wants to breed so let's give him what he wants. He's looking for a cow in heat so why not give him an estrus whine and nock an arrow in a spot that he has to come looking for you only to meet his demise from your arrow. Or you can make a riskier play and just move in for a shot while his heads in a tree

[easeup]

there you have it. this very play happened to me about 5 yrs ago.
I went with trophy's plan. I cow called a little and waited. he just raked the tree. I moved closer and repeated. He raked the tree.
I cut out a 100 yds on him and he is at about 60 yds now. still raking. At this point I felt I was too close to call anymore. I waited. He raked the tree again and walked out of my life.
what do the elk killers think? ( hope this reply does not jack the thread you started)

[Swamp Buck]

Good Stuff. This could be a good opportunity for a decoy? I think being a young bull you need to keep his interest and be persistent. Get some good cover and hunker down. Make some rocks and twig noise to paint a more realistic picture of cow and be ready. I say odds are about 50/50...

[Olydog09]

He wants the ladies attention but does not want to bugle in case there are bulls nearby to beat him down. Good time to try an estrous buzz to get him to make a move. . If blessed with a partner have him cow call while you try to sneak in. If the setrous buzz did not work and the terrain and thermals allowed I would try to move in for a shot as I have more confidence in my stealth than calling at this point in my game. Other better callers would probably bring him right in.

[Toby]

I think he is trying to call the cow to him, without vocalizing it. I would try to sneak in for a shot as he continues to work the tree over.

[AteUp]

I don't often post my opinion on these, mostly because I really don't have a good answer, but I just wanted to let you know I sure absorb the information given in these scenarios like a sponge. Keep them coming and keep the opinions coming.

[Backcountry]

If he is raking that intensively and the thermals are good I am going straight at him. Keep my movements out of his eye sight and close the distance fast. Once I'm in range all I'll do is sit and wait. If he turns to leave i'll hit him with a nervous grunt and kill him there.

[Gypsumreaper]

I love this, these are so sweet I learn from others and see what has worked what hasn't worked an learn more about elk in general, I guess in my opinion If I was alone I would go for him get as best cover between us an. Close the distance quickly with some noise so he knows I'm coming then going silent so he stays put maybe place my decoy at the last spot I make a little noise in case he gets bored, then he has a visual an May walk right past me for the decoy. If I'm with someone I would keep them above me with a few calls here an there to keep him occupied with someone else and slip in for a silent kill

[Trophyhill]

If he is raking that intensively and the thermals are good I am going straight at him. Keep my movements out of his eye sight and close the distance fast. Once I'm in range all I'll do is sit and wait. If he turns to leave i'll hit him with a nervous grunt and kill him there.

Quick question per Rory's scenario. You've already moved in to roughly 50 yards cautiously playing the thermals. You're already in range. Do you throw caution to the wind regarding thermals at this point and focus on getting into position to kill him? Or are you still worried about thermals? It just seems to me that at this point he's thrashing that tree and maybe the bull is throwing caution to the wind?

[WapitiTalk1]

Exceptional discussion about this one folks! The bull in this situation (been there more than a few times) is using non verbal communication in an attempt to impress and "call in" some chicks (responding to the cow sounds you made as you set up before and beyond the finger ridge). Not sure why they don't bugle sometimes (perhaps got his buns kicked the day before, bad hunter experience(s), cat got his tongue, sore throat , has had success using this method before, timing of the rut, etc., etc., not sure) but bulls will definitely use this method of displaying (postureing, raking, pawing/stomping the ground, running back and forth on a specific spot) in an attempt to put their elkhood on display and impress any cows within earshot. Bottom line in this scenario when Mr. Bull is standing his ground and asking for you to come to his location, oblige him, the best way you can in the terrain you're currently deployed in. What's appealed to him to this point is the cow calling, that should not be abandoned. Bugling in this scenario is probably not the best option. Pehaps work as close as possible (terrain/cover dependent) and try to coax him in with additional soft cow calls. Working the thermals, move when the raking is occurring.. he'll have his forhead into the trunks of the brush. If he's really going to town on the brush, and, it's pretty thick, you may be able to crawl right in for a close shot. As backcountry mentioned, have your nervous grunt ready to stop him for the shot if he's moving by you.

[Toby]

If he is raking that intensively and the thermals are good I am going straight at him. Keep my movements out of his eye sight and close the distance fast. Once I'm in range all I'll do is sit and wait. If he turns to leave i'll hit him with a nervous grunt and kill him there.

Quick question per Rory's scenario. You've already moved in to roughly 50 yards cautiously playing the thermals. You're already in range. Do you throw caution to the wind regarding thermals at this point and focus on getting into position to kill him? Or are you still worried about thermals? It just seems to me that at this point he's thrashing that tree and maybe the bull is throwing caution to the wind?

I'm still worried about the thermals and will stay downwind. I don't want to be this close to a good shot opportunity and then get scented before it happens.

[Trophyhill]

If he is raking that intensively and the thermals are good I am going straight at him. Keep my movements out of his eye sight and close the distance fast. Once I'm in range all I'll do is sit and wait. If he turns to leave i'll hit him with a nervous grunt and kill him there.

Quick question per Rory's scenario. You've already moved in to roughly 50 yards cautiously playing the thermals. You're already in range. Do you throw caution to the wind regarding thermals at this point and focus on getting into position to kill him? Or are you still worried about thermals? It just seems to me that at this point he's thrashing that tree and maybe the bull is throwing caution to the wind?

I'm still worried about the thermals and will stay downwind. I don't want to be this close to a good shot opportunity and then get scented before it happens.

I'm with ya on that