what do you consider "too much pressure"?

[timberland]

We all hear human pressure will move elk out of a drainage or out of the county. When do you get concerned about other hunters sharing the same mountain? I'm wondering more for early seasons, not rifle. Is it one guy bivying in a week or five trucks at a trailehead. What will push elk out of "your" area?

[Still Hunter]

One other hunter is one hunter too many for me.

[Swede]

I find that it is a combination of factors that makes the pressure and moves elk out of an area. Log trucks moving up and down a road usually have little effect on elk. Chain saws will not impact hunting in a large area by themselves, but throw in large numbers of cattle, campers, hunters with calls and all of a sudden the elk are gone. Where I hunt I believe hunters and cattle combine to cause the most pressure. With cattle also comes cowboys as they must constantly keep the cattle pushed away from the streams and on to new areas. Soon there is no good place left for the elk.

[Washington Wapiti]

Someone once said on a thread some months back, that elk country is big and will tend to swallow people up . . . to paraprhase. I can't remember who that was, but it is true! The main area I hunt isn't as vast as some other wilderness areas that I've played in, and while there is good consistent elk activity and movement there in pockets, the actual numbers of elk are not huge. I've never seen a 50-100 head of elk there like I have in Utah and other places. I've hunted the same main area for 5 seasons now, and every year there are 5-10 vehicles parked at the gate. The weekdays are better, and I make the most out of the opening week. A lot of rigs, but I haven't had this translate into running into tons of people "out there." I've only gotten concerned when it feels like the calling and pass through boot traffic is increasing around my little chunk of forest, where my stand or blind is. Not a big fan of that feeling of being squeezed. This year was really good in terms of being crowded out, and maybe the storms kept a lot of would-be hunters away. I've observed the first 3-5 days in my immediate area is the best. After that, movment starts waning and it is time to move on as evidenced by our trail cams, etc. I've also noticed lots of dudes just kind of walk through, and give up after a day or two there and move on. But I know better.

[Jaquomo]

One hunter hunting against the thermals, inside bedding areas, in mid-day swirling wnd can clear a basin pretty quickly.

Four guys hunting smart and carefully can hunt the same elk all week.

Unfortunately, I've yet to meet those four guys in one camp. There's always one guy who charges ahead, wind be damned, racing after bugles in "iffy" wind without regard for other elk in the vicinity, "checking" a couple bedding areas on his way back to camp. That's the guy who can wreck a drop camp for everyone else.

[Toby]

Are elk that live in high human traffic areas more tolerant of human activity than those in remote areas?

[Swede]

Toby, I believe the answer is both yes and no. Elk get accustomed to traffic on roads and move to a comfort zone. They learn to cross roads when traffic is gone. Elk will come and feed in a logging unit during the winter. They show up shortly after the loggers leave and move away when they return in the morning. What they don't get used to is people hiking through their bedding areas and calling and chasing after them. Jacuomo is absolutely correct in his observation. It is not just a numbers matter. Driving by animals is not near as disruptive as stopping and getting out and chasing after them. Distance is also a big factor. You can park along a road and see them peacefully feed in a field several hundred yards away. If you cross the fence and start off in their direction they run off. They get used to some things, but there is a limit.

[Jaquomo]

+1 Swede. I've hunted places where the elk heard occasional, predictable ATV traffic, for instance, and had no concern about ATVs. They'd just stand there and let them drive by. I once got off my parked ATV, took my bow off the rack and put on my pack, rounded a curve 50 yards ahead and walked smack into bedded elk. I've hunted other places with lots of ATV traffic where the elk would leave the area when they heard ATV engine sounds.

Over generations, elk will get used to humans just like whitetails. It's a learned response. Estes Park CO is a great example. Golfers have to shoo them off the greens so they can putt, and they live in town. But in areas with more recent human habitation, like where I live, they're still pretty spooky because we're next to National Forest where they're hunted and ATVs run around. The moose and deer have lost their fear, but not the elk, probably becasue the elk range a lot further into and out of the NF.

[elkmtngear]

Over generations, elk will get used to humans just like whitetails. It's a learned response.

A friend of mine that runs the local bow shop told me the best story, about a bull that lived very close to a Forest Service Road. For several years, they would park in the early AM, and hear this bull bugle from the same spot on a distant ridge almost every time they went there. They could never seem to locate this bull, he would only bugle the one time each morning!

One morning, they decided to drop Mike off on the way in, so he could try to approach the bull from a different direction. When he heard the truck get to the parking area, the bull fired off (as usual). About a minute later, he heard something coming on a dead run...and watched the bull run right by him heading back toward the parking area!

As the old saying goes, keep your friends close, and your enemies closer!

[Indian Summer]

Jaquomo hit the nail on the head. it depends on what the other hunters are doing. Most are lazy. If elk are bedded above or below a road but nobody ever leaves the road they will sit there with their mouths shut until after dark. The know they are safe there than if they get up and relocate possibly to where there are people. But... the law of averages will tell you that if there are 20 guys parked at the trailhead one of them is likely to drop off of the roads and ridge tops into the elk zone. But not everyone knows where to go even if they are willing to work hard. If I see signs that someone knows the area as well as me and is making their way from sweet spot to sweet spot I'm out of there. In that case just 1 or 2 hunters can be too many.

[Lefty]

While I perfer not to see anyone I do hunt public.
As already mentioned Guys that hunt right that is just fine.
There had been two other groups that hunt my area,.. no problem if they saw my truck or tent they went the other way. I extended the same curtousy to them.
Guys that bust into an area with vehicles during prime time ( including early morning) instead of walking in, guys the dink with my trail cam, crap in my blind ( Go ahead and use it, it is on public land ) Breacking of off road regulations See me glassing an area then charge in. Guys that bust out elk just to find them,..
The area I had hunted got some press this year . I wasnt happy about the extra hunters, but even more unhappy the way they hunted

I will say if forced me to hunt else where, scout elsewhere duing the season ,.. and I think I found a new happy place, more isolated and remote, cant illeagally get there with a motorized vehicle

[timberland]

Any advice for those of us that can't scout new areas until they are actually hunting and have to deal with other hunters. I know enough to get away from them. How about looking for escape/isolated areas. Go at night and listen for bugles?

[>>>---WW---->]

The three main things that equal "too much pressure" around here are:
1) Heavy snows
Snow is a given and brings on the winter migration. If you have never witnessed it, there are herds that number in the thousands. A sight to
behold.
2) Rifle seasons
DOW statistics show that the very first day of the first rifle season is when the biggest harvest occurs. Hmmm! I wonder where all the elk go after
that?? By the way, We have 4 regular rifle seasons as well as some rifle draw seasons that run for as long as five full months. August 15 through
January 15
3) Sheep
Most sheep flocks number anywhere from 1000-3000 animals. When they move, the elk leave town......

[Gutpile]

New to the forum here so greetings to everyone. Not a day goes by without elk on the brain, so this is probably a good place to be! I'm lucky to live in an area with a local elk herd. They seem totally immune to vehicle traffic and people do approach for pictures, but this does not seem to irritate them too much. I have tons of pics from my deck - and the elk tolerate my presence and even my dogs to some degree. But, they are not being pursued or shot at in this area so more like Estes Park elk. If you approach or call with a "get close attitude", they move off. I've hunted the last few years in a unit with tons of pressure. Approximately 1200 hunters in archery and muzzy season alone. What surprises me is how tight the elk will hold with so much commotion in the area. I've been able to find a few spots that regularly have elk in them and despite the numbers, most folks only walk in from large, easy accessible trail heads. I've seen elk 1/2 a mile from the road many times, but almost no hunters once i'm in the woods. i've also seen elk when i could hear talking/shooting/chainsawing from just down the hill at a popular camp site - all during hunting season. I know hunters move elk out of areas all the time, and i'm sure i'm guilty of that as well, but my experience in the last few years has been they move to hidden but accessible spots and simply stay put and shut up.....Thanks again for all the advice on the forum - much to learn!