Elk Hunting Basics......Your Move, Thread #5

[Still Hunter]

I was asked to do one of these, so here we go. Keep in mind I did no calling in my hunting at this time. This year will be the first time i'll try that. This was 10 years ago.

I'm in the Colorado Rockies at 10,500ft. It's the 2nd rifle season, and the rut is over. I'm working the dark timber looking for a tired bull after he wore himself out in the rut. It's 11am. I working along a bench slowly. There a small park (meadow) ahead, and another bench above me. As I move in slow motion along the deadfall I catch scent of an elk. I'm looking hard in every place an elk could be bedded down. One quiet step, and look somemore. The smell is getting stronger, and the slight breeze is in my face. I know the elk is ahead of me. I continue like this for another 30 minutes. Not traveling more than 50yds. I know i'm close, but I can't him. I say him, because in this situation it would be a bull alone. Another 15 min, and there he is next to a log laying down. Unfortunately, he's looking right at me. He must have seen my last step I took, and he stands up and starts to walk away. All I have in sight is his rear. No shot. I froze in position. He looks back once, and walks a little faster out of sight towards the park.

What would you do?

[Backcountry]

Nervous grunt to get him to possibly stop for another opportunity? How far from the park are we?

[Trophyhill]

I'd try to get above him parallel along the bench hopefully where I could see the park for a shot if he wanders into the open or an ambush as he makes his way onto the bench. With my 7mag the only obstacle with distance are shooting lanes on that bench.

[Still Hunter]

The park is about 100yds. I'm using a Winchester 94 in 30-30 with iron sights. No long shots were ever taken with it. Most were at bow range. This one was a 50yd shot.

[>>>---WW---->]

That's a great answer Backcountry. A nervous bark would have stopped him on a dime. And even if he didn't give a broadside shot, he would have turned his head and looked. Just place your sights about one inch below his jaw bone and squeeze. No tracking job required!

However, there is just one problem. Still Hunter said the bull started walking faster and headed out of sight towards the meadow. This tells me he is suspicious but not overly alarmed. It doesn't sound like he was buggered! You had the wind in your favor so there is a possibility he may circle to see what spooked him. Stay still for awhile and keep your eyes open. If that doesn't work, try a couple of soft cow mews followed by a gathering call or lost cow call.

If this doesn't work, I'm betting he won't step out in the opening of that meadow you mentioned. He'll probably skirt the edge of it. So don't over look that possibility. If you don't catch up with him there, better luck next time.

[Still Hunter]

Put your calls away boys. You're trying to figure out what I did. I used no calls, and I did shoot the bull.

[Trumkin the Dwarf]

Big bulls don't get big being stupid. I'd bet heavily against him going through the park/meadow. If there is snow on the ground I'd just wait a minute or three and pick the trail up again. If not, I'd hop up to the next bench and try to catch him as he loops up to his next bed.

[WapitiTalk1]

Dirty thirty Winchester with iron sights still hunting... step, listen, look, smell, wait; step, listen, look, smell, wait. Mountain poetry! The bull is now aware potential danger (sight of upright hunter silhouette possibly) and is moving to safety. My bet is that he wouldn't stay on the same elevation towards the park but ultimately move up to the next level or higher. I know this as my dad used to use my brothers and I for bird dogs in a sense on Montana hill sides as he roamed the ridge top This bull is not busted, but now is aware that there is potential danger on his bedding bench. Option 1 (I'm out there, try to get a shot now): Take a hard right and slowly pick my way up to the next level/bench and move left (step, listen, look, smell wait... repeat) watching for movement of the elk heading uphill, or, catch an antler tip where he's bedded again. Option 2 (if my hunting trip/days allowed permits): Check out the area and see if the bull has been bedding there for a period of days; back out completely and do the same hunt the next day but be there a bit earlier. Bullwinkle just may be back in the same place. Just my .02. I'm anxious to hear how this one played out still hunter. Good stuff.

[Still Hunter]

Ok, you guys are close enough, so i'll finish the hunt for you.

I'm standing frozen as the bull walks away. He took one quick look back, and I was like a statue. He kept walking towards the park. The timber was too thick for me to see what he did when he got to the park. After 10 minutes I started to walk slowly up to the next bench. Since he wasn't totally spooked. I counted on him staying on the lower bench. I moved along the upper bench as quietly as possible. It was too far down to the lower bench for me to see it. I've scouted both benches, so I knew them well. My thoughts were that he probably went around the park, and was somewhere on the other side of it. I went what I thought was far enough on the upper bench to be past where he was, and then started to drop back down the bench. I had to be very careful now, because the wind was no longer in my favor. I wanted to find him while I was still between the benches, and the wind wasn't completely against me. I spotted him just inside the timber from the park. He hadn't gone that far. He had got on the other side of the park, and was lined up with where we were together, and he was looking back in that direction. He wanted to see if I followed him. He wasn't moving. Just staring in that direction. I worked my way between the benches being as quiet as I possibly could. Hoping the wind wouldn't swirl.

It all worked out, and I put a 170gr Partition from the old 30-30 into both lungs. He ran about 50 yds, and piled up. A very fun hunt, and what I love about still hunting.


Thanks for your interest.

[LckyTylr]

That's awesome, well played.

Where's the pic!

[Still Hunter]

If you knew me. You wouldn't ask that question.

This is the first time i've talked about a hunt. Not likely it will happen again. I don't take pictures, or keep antlers. It's how my dad brought me up. I hunted with him for 25 years, before he passed away, and i've hunted alone since then. What he taught me is very ingrained in me now. Some guys won't believe anything without pictures, and that their choice. It's also my choice to do it my way. For me the hunt is everything. The kill is unimportant, except to show me I did the hunt right, and I put food on the table.

So, sorry. No pictures.

[ElkNut1]

Pete, congrats on a great stalk & hunt, nice story too! Thanks.

You did ask "What would you do" at the end of your 1st post! (grin) As for me, I too would have used the nervous grunt to freeze that bull in his tracks. Timing is key here in its use, as soon as that bull stood up & his head was turned the other way as you described I would have used the nervous grunt simultaneously as I shouldered the 30/30. That bull would most likely turned to face you to look for the elk that was asking him for identification. The nervous grunt is used within their own ranks when unsure of a movement/sound or anything that they are unsure of, it can also be an invite for other elk to show themselves. This is why it's such a powerful tool when utilized correctly. -- It would not have worked while the bull was staring at you, he must be looking away & once he hears this sound asking something of him he's forced to react to a sound that makes sense to him. -- Now if the bull would have exploded out of his bed the odds are not good that any sound would have worked, but in your case he was just unsure of what you were.

The nervous grunt can be done with ones voice (my favorite) or a simple mouth reed already in your mouth leaving you hands free! I'm sure you've heard this sound many times over the years but possibly unsure as to its use? Here it is & is found in the Tips & Tactics Forum. viewtopic.php?f=11&t=73

ElkNut1

[JGH]

Great conversation ... I'm going to try to perfect that nervous grunt this year.

But for now, I'm just trying to resist the urge to buy a Win 94 .30-30!

Thanks for putting that back in my head. I thought I had suppressed that urge.

[Still Hunter]

Paul..........I'm sure we might have a different way to handle that situation. Being an expert caller, of course you would use calls. I may too in the future if i get comfortable with it.

I was upset with myself at the time, because he saw me first. My kind of hunting requires me to see him first. Then I can be ready for the shot. There was a tree blocking his antlers, and I saw them too late. Had he gone off to either side. Even in a run I would have shot him. I've practiced running shots since I was a youngster. My dad setup moving targets, and I practiced everyday. He never gave me a shot though, so the best I could do was stay frozen, and make the bull wonder what I was. I knew the way he walked away I could get him later. That part worked out perfect. He had no clue I was there when I shot him.

Exposing myself with calls is new to me, and frankly, i'm hesitant about trying it. I'm sure I will, but i'll need to do much more work with it before trying it. I'm pretty stubborn about doing something right when I have my mind set on it.

[ElkNut1]

Pete, you do very well the way you hunt, please note no one is saying you should change a thing. Going on ones experience & instincts is a powerful tool in itself & you possess both! Selective calling can be advantageous but not a cure all! (grin) I mention the nervous grunt because my son & i have taken roughly 15 bulls with this sound that may have otherwise still be out there, it has proved to be a life saver in time of need! (grin) The nervous grunt is just a sound to consider when in a tight spot, meaning you may never see him again if something solid isn't done! Knowing what you know now about this sound just think back on the years you've hunted where this sound could have possibly turned an encounter around to be more favorable? I do know there are times that I've been in that without it no shot would have been had. Just food for thought! Good luck my friend!

ElkNut1

[Still Hunter]

Just so i'm understanding this. Are you using the grunt after the bull see's you?

[ElkNut1]

In your case yes! The bull did not know for sure what it was he was looking at, he saw movement but could not identify a threat or not or he would have exploded out of there, I'm sure you've seen this happen in the past! Once he stood & turned away that was your cue to plant the seed of doubt, what he possibly saw was another elk by the use of the nervous grunt & this elk was asking him who or what he was! --- It would be too late to use if you waited until he trotted off or he had exploded out of there. In most cases when within range you are looking for the broadside to quartering away shot that is offered for that split second as doubt or curiosity is planted in his head & he turns to look for this elk that called! Again, it's just something that has worked for us for many years as well as for WW, it's a very deadly sound when used correctly because unlike a cow call the nervous grunt asks for an action out of other elk!

ElkNut1

[Still Hunter]

So, even though I don't look like another elk. If I sound like one he'll accept that?

[ElkNut1]

Pete, in the situation you described yes! Elk do not run at the sight of the human figure whether standing or kneeling down. It's when that figure moves that he gives himself away. Yes an elk can see you & stare you down but in time (a few minutes at times or less) if you do not move they will loose interest in you & settle down. I've been caught countless times in an opening with nothing to hide behind & have had this happen, the game is not over if you do not move or they don't smell you. It takes intense concentration at times & muscles that you never knew you had to maintain composure & not flinch at all. I know you are not big into photos but here are 3 different bulls I took that were taken, 18yds, 14yds, 22yds. All these bulls spotted me but when I won the mexican standoff/stare down they settled down to feed, rake or mosey around until I saw my opportunity to take them in an instant. Just showing the human figure does not spook them, I've taken other bulls too that were a very similar situation that ended up on my plate too! (grin)

ElkNut1

[Still Hunter]

Not what I meant Paul. I understand I can stand still, and the elk/deer won't be spooked. I've done it more times than I can ever remember.

I never made a sound though. Not a peep. If I was staring down an elk, and grunted. The elk knows i'm not an elk. It's not sure what I am, but it knows i'm not an elk. Wouldn't the grunt throw up a red flag for him?

I'm not giving you a hard time. I'm just trying to understand. This goes against everything i've done all my life. It's going to take awhile for it to sink in.


btw Nice bulls.

[ElkNut1]

Pete, not sure I'm following you here bud? I've mentioned a couple of times that when the nervous grunt is needed you wait for them to turn their head or they are not looking your way at all, in most cases we will use it to stop an elk in a small window for a shot. I've also used it many times to stop elk on a dead run, not from seeing me but running from other elk. There are few occasions & I mean rare ones where a hunter should make any elk sound while an elk is looking your way, that's not a good habit to get into. As I said above "timing" is everything! Does this help?

ElkNut1

[Still Hunter]

Ok, i'm being stubborn. What I was saying is even if I used a grunt when he turns away. He would know it came from me, and he knows i'm not an elk. He just looked at me. He was suspicious, and walked away. Now I make an elk sound. He thinks what?


This was a rare situation for me. The blowdown tree that was blocking his antlers was at a perfect angle to keep the antlers out of my sight as I moved forward. Otherwise I would have spotted him much earlier, and before he saw me. Then I could have set up for the shot when he stood up. When he didn't spook I knew I would have another chance at him. Which I did. Although I wasn't still hunting anymore at that point, but stalking. That's not my thing, and not as exciting. I don't like to know where the animal is. I like to find them first before they see me, and not know where they are before I find them.

So, I guess what i'm saying is, even if I was using calls at that time. I'm not sure i'd use it if I thought I had a chance of shooting it without a call.

Does that make sense to you Paul?

[>>>---WW---->]

Pete: You are the one that said this. "OK I'm just being stubborn"!

If the running game isn't working, try the pass! Don't be a one dementional player in the elk hunting game. Learning how to call and learning how to call RIGHT could open new doors for you. With your still hunting experience and learning how to call, you would be one deadly elk hunting machine.

[Still Hunter]

I am learning, and I plan to try calling next season. I always thought that calling was used to fool the elk into thinking you're an elk. This means you call when you're out of sight of the elk. This didn't seem to apply to the above situation. My natural instinct is to stay quiet once the elk has seen me.

[ElkNut1]

Pete, I sent you a PM.

ElkNut1

[elkmtngear]

Three of us in a line this Season (Archery)...still hunting together through dark timber, mid day.

Jumped a four point bull out of his bed in the blowdowns at 30 yards.

I gave a Nervous Grunt using my voice...and the bull stopped dead in his tracks in the timber, with three humans in plain view. He stood there for a good 30 seconds at 45 yards. Unfortunately, we couldn't get a lane on him through the timber.

It is a powerful tool IMHO that can give you possibilities, sometimes even when you are completely busted.

[Still Hunter]

Just talked to Paul on the phone. I'll be working on the grunt.