New to the Board Intro/Question

[loblolly7]

Hey everyone, I just joined the forum and have already been learning a lot from y'all. I'm from Mississippi originally but have been living in Memphis, TN for about a year now. I drew a general unit tag in Wyoming this year and my two brothers and I will be attempting a DIY backpacking archery hunt in early September south of Jackson Hole. We are completely new to elk hunting and I'm looking to absorb as much knowledge as I can from anyone willing to share it. I've been doing a ton of online scouting with google earth and topo maps and I think I have figured out a general area that I want to focus on. Our plan is to hike in and set up camp one day, then hunt 5-6 days before packing out. I am interested in anyone's thoughts on how to select a camp site. Is it better to camp high to avoid a tough up-hill hike before sunrise or is it better to camp down near the valley where water would be more abundant and I assume would be better camping conditions? Also, how do I avoid setting up camp in the middle of a spot that might bust elk out of the area or spook them? Thanks for any help y'all may be able to give me.

[Swede]

Welcome to the forum Loblolly. You have an interesting handle. Is it associated with the pine trees in your part of the country? For a hunter going out after elk for the first time you ask some good questions. Be carful not to pack in farther than you can pack an elk out. It may be impossible not to be in elk where you spike camp. I don't know your area, but just pick a good camp site and don't make a lot of noise there. Minimize you impact as best you can. If you get an elk, celebrate when you get back to the truck. As for water in the west, you can almost always find springs well up on the mountain sides. I would locate them on AcmeMapper or some other topographic web site if possible. Best wishes.

[loblolly7]

Thank you, Swede. Yes, my handle is in reference to the loblolly pines in the south. I have a forestry background. As a follow-up question, let's say I find elk in a certain area, is there a rule of thumb for how far away I should make spike camp from them? Also, say I run into other hunters or another camp site, is there some un-written law of the mountain on how to share hunting areas? The last thing I want to do is mess someone else's hunt up or have anyone angry with me just due to my ignorance. Thanks.

[Swede]

Loblolly I think the best approach, if there is another hunting camp near where you plan to hunt, is to just go and talk a few minutes with them. Let them know you will be in the area too and ask about camping and hunting in the vicinity. The vast majority of people will be fair and cordial. The others just leave alone and camp where you are not interfering with them at all. You are hunting public land and can legally camp where you please. Just be considerate. You will hear occasionally how their grandpappy first hunted there and they have hunted the area for 30 years: bla, bla. They try to imply they have some priority. Ignore it and move a respectful distance away. Remember the negative type is rare, and you can do yourself a favor by going over to meet most people.
When I spike camp, I like to set up on the edge of the area I will hunt, where the evening and morning diurnal winds will carry my scent out of my hunting grounds. I would not make too big a deal about the matter. Elk are 1000 percent different than Whitetail deer. The elk have a huge range. If you are in your tent, and they are around camp it is no bid deal. If you are outside cooking or doing something else, and they pass by, it won't ruin your hunt. Unless you are prepared to stalk them, then don't go after them and don't bugle or cow call. Don't call elk after they have seen you. All you are doing is educating them to associate your call with you. If the elk recognize what you are, calling them is a mistake.
I am retired U.S. Forest Service. I ran into elk fairly frequently at times. They did not go far just because they saw me. It was always interesting how the elk would come into logging areas in the evening as soon as the loggers left, and leave when the loggers arrived back in the early morning. They figure it our quickly when they are being pursued.

[Lefty]

Not knowing specially where you are hunting. But much of that area has water up high. And the elk may not be moving around a whole lot. What I mean is the elk may only change 500 foot elevation during their night to day cycle.
This year I selected a campsite above or even with the elk ll expected to hunt, And a secondary camp on a ridge line where we could call or listen off of each side.
Last year my camp was situated where I worked up 600 feet in elevation then back down. However I started hunting just a few hundred yards from camp.
In the past I hunted the desert and I tried to not camp where elk would hang out,... that didnt really work, each year I had elk in camp. And wih a pack in camp I feel nothing wrong with knowing where the elk are when you wake up Just be quiet
One thing to keep in mind. I always had everything ready to hunt right from camp,,... no opening and closing doors, no need for light, no digging through the back pack Just putting on gear and heading out.

[WapitiTalk1]

As another option, you may wish to consider just base camp hunting for this first trip out to the Cowboy State. The packing into and staying in the backcountry to camp/hunt is nothing less than awesome, but, with this area being new to you and really, unproven... I'd hate to see you and your team get back in there, set up camp and discover the area is perhaps not what you thought it was (minimal elk, more hunting pressure than anticipated, etc.). By using a base camp set up, you can do hunts into areas until you hit a spot that you like... It's a heck of a lot easier to try different spots from a road base camp than from a static back country camp. Just a thought.

Oh, welcome to the forum!! RJ

[loblolly7]

Thanks guys. Being so new to this, I guess I'm just going to have to figure most of it out on the ground. Hopefully I am able to spot some elk on the hike in to make everything easier! This may be a stupid question, and I know people say elk are where you find them, but should I expect to cover miles and miles between elk sightings? For instance, would it be better to get as high as possible first thing in the morning where I can glass miles in multiple directions to try and spot elk to move on, or just pick out a single drainage or block of timber and work my way through it without knowing if elk are in there or not? I'm focusing on WY Unit 84 in case anyone had any particular experience in that unit. I've thought about doing a base camp, but then I worry about wearing myself out hiking far enough every day to get away from the most hunting pressure.

[WapitiTalk1]

Ahh, that's the beauty of SEP archery elk hunting; the elk are at their vocal peak! You'll do well to locate them by listening (or even calling) from spots at night where you can hear from a distance. Patterning elk is important (identifying their transition routes can provide ambush spots). They normally move from feed to bed right after daybreak, bed down throughout the day on N/NE facing slopes (where it's cooler) usually 2/3 to 3/4 up the side of a hillside (this way they can smell what's coming from below with the thermals rising, and, are close enough to the top to hear danger/predators from above). A herd bull will get up to stretch his legs and do a herd count several times throughout the day... this is how I've spotted them on thick hillsides many times. A tending herd bull will also spout off once in a while from his bedding area. Not far before sunset, the herd will start moving to their nighttime feeding area. You'll hear it many times as you pour through all the threads here (make sure you dig through the archived tips section) but the wind is your most important ally in the elk woods, and, your worst enemy. Once elk have been located, you sometimes have to back out completely until the wind is in your favor for a stalk, or, do some serious hikes to ensure the wind is in your favor before you proceed. As a general rule, the thermals fall in the early morning thru mid morning then shift all over the place until they are ultimately rising up the terrain for the majority of the day. Have you and your bros been working on your calling yet?

[Indian Summer]

First... do NOT invest (key word) time and effort into packing a camp in until you have confirmed that it is worth it. Even if you can make it out during the summer to learn the lay of the land a bit stick with a base camp for starters. Go in about a mile or 2 and then bail off of any trails. Then work your way further in. You may find elk closer to the truck than you think. Or yu may just find that even though the elk are a bit further in they are still huntable from a base camp to the point where giving up 2 full days of hunting to pack isn't worth it.

If you think you might be interested in a hunt plan in the same area you are looking at let me know. I have a big heapum experience in them thar hills. See the DIY Hunts page on my website. Welcome aboard!
www.headinwest.net
Joe Ferraro

[saddlesore]

I might have a different tack on it, but I don't liketo camp right next to prime elk habitat. As for camping low or high, I will always camp lower. I don't know what elevation you will be hunting,but here in CO, normally 8-9000 feet is where the hunting is done. If over that, I at least like to get back to the lower elevation or sleeping.It lets your body recuperate during the night for the oxygen deprivation that takes place during the day.

Lefty makes some good points about being quiet. Unfortuneately, not many guys understand just how quite you have to be. That is why I recomend camping further away

[Deanmac]

great comments guys, I enjoyed the read

[ElkNut1]

Welcome to the Forum bud! As a newer elk hunter I'd seriously consider a Base camp over a bivy style hunt. You will be more mobile & hunt a variety of spots in hopes of locating elk! Works for us! Too, you don't have issues of busting out elk this way either!

ElkNut1

[Waygoner]

Doesn't Wyoming require a non-res to hire a guide when hunting wilderness?

[mottlet]

Welcome to the forum! I've also got some Mississippi roots.

FWIW, I'm hunting a unit in Colorado this year with someone (not a local) that has hunted there before. This will be my second elk hunt. I immediately started looking at the unit on Google Earth and found some great looking country, a ways off the road and figured we should pack into there and set up shop. We'd be able to hit three different drainages, all with food, water, and cover. I brought it up with my partner and his response was, "Yeah, but what if there aren't any elk there?" But why wouldn't there be? It looks great! "What if there are four wall tents and a whole posse of cowboys guiding flatlanders like us on horses and mules?"

Point is, he's taken two bulls out of this unit and called in a bunch and he hunts from a base camp. Over time, he's built up a good list of spots that he can hit up by leaving camp and walking into the woods, or driving to a different trailhead. If it's easier to move the whole operation to the other end of the unit, it's not a problem to do so. We will be prepared to spike for a couple of days if we gather intel that lets us know it's wise to do so. But for the most part, we're looking at spots all over the unit.

[saddlesore]

Doesn't Wyoming require a non-res to hire a guide when hunting wilderness?

Yes,but a local resident accompanying the hunter is OK too I believe

[saddlesore]

Of course with time constraints and a short hunt, it is often thought that if you don't see elk in prime habitat,you need to move. The problem here is you can see elk the first day of the hunt and then not any elk for the next five days or so,or you can not see any elk until the last day. The first situation,you problem blew them out of the area and the latter ,someone else probably blew them out of an area and they came into your.

You have to be mobile for sure, but you can end up chasing a lot of ghost jumping from place to place, especially if you don't know the country

You need to be able to at least hunt in a five mile radius of where you camp,If it is prime elk habitat ,the elk will be there,you just have to find them

[Brendan]

Doesn't Wyoming require a non-res to hire a guide when hunting wilderness?

Yes, but there are plenty of non-wilderness areas too where a guide isn't needed.

[loblolly7]

Thanks for all the helpful tips. We may just end up doing a base camp; I'll have to talk it over with my brothers. I'll keep doing my research and I'm sure I'll pepper the board with more questions along the way.

[Indian Summer]

To base or to pack. That is often the question. But here's the lowdown on that. There is nothing wrong with packing a camp in. But it takes time and time is very valuable. Very. So the next question becomes are you doing it to have better hunting or for the fun and experience of being away from it all for awhile. If so then go for it. You'll have a blast for sure. But once you get better at elk hunting, learn some areas, and all that stuff do you think you'll still ask yourself the same questions?

More than likely you'll find a place that maximizes your time by hunting it from the truck. Nothing is more time efficient than pulling in with everything you need, setting it up, and getting down to business. Also like Elknut said and has said before... you'll be more mobile and versatile from a base camp.

The experience of a back country camp is awesome no doubt. But the downside is that you are committed and limited to one area unless you dump more time into packing out and relocating. The attraction of packing in and also the perception of better hunting leads most guys to go through the curve starting by going that route and then evolving to base camps. There will always be pack in hunters because some people just love it. Those people are usually in pretty good shape and can live with minimal supplies. But the success rate is no different and might not even be as good. My point here is that when you talk it over with your brothers you should make sure you take a serious look at the pros, cons, and reasons why you might want to do one or the other. This website is a good place to find out what some of those things are too.

Here's a con: I've seen guys so beat up from packing their camp and gear in that they had to take the next day off and weren't in much better shape the day after that. Like elk hunting itself it's definitely for some folks but not for everyone.

[Swede]

I think Indian Summer has some very wise comments based on plenty of experience. I know what he is referring to and he is right.
I have another option that is a middle ground. I sometimes pack in for just two or three miles. It doesn't take all that long to move in and out. If I find it is not as good in season as when I went there scouting, then I pack out and go somewhere else. Two miles is enough to get you away from 90% of the hunters along the roads. You may have opportunities that the trailer campers miss, and you can enjoy the solitude. If you start packing an elk out for two or even three miles you will know if you can handle any more. I know that is my limit and more than I can handle alone.

[Tigger]

Another thing I will add is that if this is your first time, you will likely haul in stuff you wont need and not bring stuff you do need. The ability to have plenty of food, water, other supplies and a somewhat more comfortable camp is also a consideration. We base camp, but are ready to spike if we see the reason for it. We actually haven't found that reason yet but this year are planning on doing it just for fun once.

One thing I will stress is the physical exertion and exhaustion that comes with an elk hunt. No matter how you do it, the ability to recharge the batteries is plennny important!

[Cowbell]

Hey guys. I am also new to the forum and also have MS roots. We are actually planning to hunt the same area around Jackson this rifle season. These are a lot of the same questions I have had and so reading this has been very beneficial. I appreciation everyone's input. I'm hoping our first trip out is not to just educate elk.