Questions a drop camp?

[blackbruin]

So if I get the idea right, drop camps by an outfitter are permitted in certain areas and are usually the same spots year after year. So in essence you are primarily paying for a camp ready to go and the ride in and out with the chance of hauling an elk out too. That the spots are hit and miss with repeat customers getting the usually better areas. I understand if you sit at camp that makes it even less. Is there usually a minimum ? It would only be me and a good friend. Thanks

[saddlesore]

Repeat clients do not necessarily get the same camps. It is all a matter of when they book the hunt. They may have a preference,but it is not guaranteed. The camps are usually in about the same spot because of water availability, good camping spot, and such.A good outfitter will locate their camps away from prime elk habitat, but close enough for hunters to walk there with enough distance from other camps. If not, they won't get repeat clients.

As for a minimum, it varies, a lone or two hunters might be asked to share a camp with others that he/she doe snot know, or the outfitter might have camps that are set up for less hunters.

The other option is to provide all your own gears and have an outfitter pack it in. If you know where you want to go, then the outfitter is usually not restrained as to only putting the campi n a certain location

[blackbruin]

Thanks, I'm just looking for info on the basics, my understanding is that weather, pressure etc... will affect how your hunt goes. We are not restrained to a week or what not we don't care on time, we do care about getting in to acclimate and kinda get a feel. Am I wrong to assume first rifle you are more likely to get in earlier and less so with more chance for snow in 2nd?

[Elkduds]

In CO the 1st rifle season is 5 days long, Sat-Wed. 2nd and 3rd rifle seasons are Sat through the following Sun, 9 days. 4th is Sat-Wed, like 1st. I suppose you could get packed in a few days early and scout before start of 1st season. By scout I mean sit and glass, not push or chase elk.

[saddlesore]

This year in CO,note that the elk seasons are one week later than usual. Normally the 1st season is the 2nd Saturday in OCT, but since this year the 1st is on a Saturday. The opening day is the 15th. Which is the3rd Saturday. Usually the CPW prefers the opening dates to be after the grazing leases are done and live stock are moved out.
You might be right about getting packed in earlier in the 1st.Outfitters are usually packing clients out the Thursday after the 1st season ends. The only sure way is to discuss it with the outfitter when booking and get the date firmed

[blackbruin]

Thanks for the info, this is for 2017 but we figure we outta book soon.

[saddlesore]

Yes, one outfitter I know has been booking hunts for 2017 for several months already

[Indian Summer]

Camp locations are in the outfitter's operation plan on file with the U.S. Forest Service so it's not like they can just pick a spot and throw up a tent. Also an outfitter isn't going to set up a camp and then move it, or set multiple camps so he can switch locations from week to week if he doesn't have to. The point is you'll probably be in the same camp as repeats or other hunters. If you are bow hunting I would nail my 2017 dates down right now. For gun I'd say get in the books by the end of September before other gun hunters start coming back home and thinking about next year.

[saddlesore]

Also,a lot off clients book their hunt at the end of their present hunt

[Timber]

@ blackbruin I have been emailing an outfitter that will do a drop camp to the location that you pick with your gear. It is a little cheaper then their normal drop camp also. I do like this idea a bit better and I am sure other outfitters will do the same deal.

[Gypsumreaper]

Also depends on an outfitters use days and number of camps allowed on their permit area some outfitters may only have 4-5 camp spots some may have as many as 20. If you deal with the right outfitter they may be more inclined to give you what you want if they have the means to provide it. I have seen guys that book a drop camp with an outfitter and pay for an overnight trip in the area in the later summer with the same outfitter. Then they allowed him to somewhat choose his camp out of the locations he was allowed. 2016 is booking up really fast if not already booked up. And since Colorado draw results are posted today phones start blowing up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[blackbruin]

I have contacted and received response back from 5 outfitters. Only one told me they would take me in as early as I want say Monday before the Saturday opener. The rest were one or two day..His references were very good and pretty local to me, I'm stopping by to see a guy who has been going for a long time with him but his own equipment. I'm sure after a few times I'll be buying everything I need and just need packing in. Any other helpful hints are appreciated thanks.

[saddlesore]

If you will be hunting at 9000 ft or so, arrive in the area a few days early. A lot of mountain towns in CO , at least, are 7000 ft or so and even that will help get you acclimated. I'm you are with a credible outfitter, you should be at least close to good elk hunting. Find out where your camp is exactly and then get to studying maps and Google earth . You should be able to figure out where to be opening day. A lot of guys get there early and go busting around the country driving the elk out. They see the elk two days before the season opens and then wonder where the elk went

[Indian Summer]

@ blackbruin I have been emailing an outfitter that will do a drop camp to the location that you pick with your gear. It is a little cheaper then their normal drop camp also. I do like this idea a bit better and I am sure other outfitters will do the same deal.

That would not be considered a drop camp. That is simply hiring a packer. Some outfitters will do that for you. Some cannot because of regulations. In western Wyoming they don't permit drop camps or packing only services. An outfitter I know and I went round and round with the Forest Service because I wanted him to pack me in and they were very clear... No Packing or Drops!

[blackbruin]

Being first time for us I didn't want to spend money on things to camp with without knowing what exactly to buy and not have to buy things twice or whatnot.

We have found the right guy, letting us in plenty before to get our bearings. Is very willing to work with you, heck will even send us maps, trail cam pics etc.

I bought a pair of vortex hd glasses and an alaskan guide creations bino harness in preparation..... now instead of my kids killing my ears with a saxaphone, trumpet, and clarinet, I can do it to them with my reed calls!

[saddlesore]

@ blackbruin I have been emailing an outfitter that will do a drop camp to the location that you pick with your gear. It is a little cheaper then their normal drop camp also. I do like this idea a bit better and I am sure other outfitters will do the same deal.

That would not be considered a drop camp. That is simply hiring a packer. Some outfitters will do that for you. Some cannot because of regulations. In western Wyoming they don't permit drop camps or packing only services. An outfitter I know and I went round and round with the Forest Service because I wanted him to pack me in and they were very clear... No Packing or Drops!

Wonder if that regulation was pushed thru by the same lobby that pushed the one of requiring a guide in Wilderness areas

[Timber]

@ blackbruin I have been emailing an outfitter that will do a drop camp to the location that you pick with your gear. It is a little cheaper then their normal drop camp also. I do like this idea a bit better and I am sure other outfitters will do the same deal.

That would not be considered a drop camp. That is simply hiring a packer. Some outfitters will do that for you. Some cannot because of regulations. In western Wyoming they don't permit drop camps or packing only services. An outfitter I know and I went round and round with the Forest Service because I wanted him to pack me in and they were very clear... No Packing or Drops!

I had no idea WY had another law stupider law than the wilderness one. So again what I am getting from this is I can haul all my junk into a hunting spot 5 miles away(a non wilderness area of course if I was in WY) but I can not hire a outfitter to for a drop camp or to "hire a packer"(which is pretty much the same thing to me) if I wanted to do this in WY. I love hunting WY but some of their rules and regulations are some of the stupidest things I have ever heard of. Who makes these idiotic rules because it sounds like something out of Chicago, L.A ect ect......

[Waygoner]

So if you beat an outfitter to one of their camp spots, can they kick you out?

Camp locations are in the outfitter's operation plan on file with the U.S. Forest Service so it's not like they can just pick a spot and throw up a tent. Also an outfitter isn't going to set up a camp and then move it, or set multiple camps so he can switch locations from week to week if he doesn't have to. The point is you'll probably be in the same camp as repeats or other hunters. If you are bow hunting I would nail my 2017 dates down right now. For gun I'd say get in the books by the end of September before other gun hunters start coming back home and thinking about next year.

[Timber]

Also the outfitter I was talking to was from Colorado and not Wyoming but good information to know about Wyoming! Constantly learning new tricks and rules in all these states.

[Gypsumreaper]

So if you beat an outfitter to one of their camp spots, can they kick you out?

Camp locations are in the outfitter's operation plan on file with the U.S. Forest Service so it's not like they can just pick a spot and throw up a tent. Also an outfitter isn't going to set up a camp and then move it, or set multiple camps so he can switch locations from week to week if he doesn't have to. The point is you'll probably be in the same camp as repeats or other hunters. If you are bow hunting I would nail my 2017 dates down right now. For gun I'd say get in the books by the end of September before other gun hunters start coming back home and thinking about next year.

In Colorado an outfitters assigned areas are their areas, they should have signs posted that this is their camp spot per the USFS. Am outfitter has the right to ask you to leave the spot, but only if their signs were posted before you got their. We post them in our area before hunting season and we are responsible for that area. In wilderness areas rules are a lot stricter and outfitters can get some massive fines over the smallest things. If I come up on a camp that is set up in my assigned spot and my signs have been posted I have no choice but to ask you to leave to another spot, due to the fact that I can't just set up 50 yards away and call it good. But it also comes down to if my clients want to be that close to another camp. If I don't have clients I'll move myself to another spot but if my clients are there I'm kinda stuck. Only time I would ever get the USFS involved is if the area is trashed due to the fact that I don't want to get fined for stuff I didn't do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Waygoner]

Good info Gypsumreaper. Thanks.

[Indian Summer]

So if you beat an outfitter to one of their camp spots, can they kick you out?

Camp locations are in the outfitter's operation plan on file with the U.S. Forest Service so it's not like they can just pick a spot and throw up a tent. Also an outfitter isn't going to set up a camp and then move it, or set multiple camps so he can switch locations from week to week if he doesn't have to. The point is you'll probably be in the same camp as repeats or other hunters. If you are bow hunting I would nail my 2017 dates down right now. For gun I'd say get in the books by the end of September before other gun hunters start coming back home and thinking about next year.

Gypsum has it right. Yes they can as long as the signs were up. An outfitter must reserve his assigned or season long sites in advance. Those ones require him to pay a fee. If he uses the site for 14 days or less he does not have to pay the fee or reserve it. In that case he would have no signs and could not ask you to leave. But if he does have them up he has no choice but to ask you to move your camp because he is not authorized to camp elsewhere so he can't just pick another spot. My guess is he would feel bad about it but then again the signs clearly state that the area 100 feet by 150 feet (or whatever) behind this sign is reserved by the outfitter authorized to operate in this area so it's not like you weren't informed. The dates will also be on the sign. He has to remove the camp within a week or two (varies by area) after he is done providing services to paying clients. He cannot just leave the camp set up on the assigned site for his own personal use.

[Gypsumreaper]

Exactly and most camp sites are paid for the entire season. Outfitters pay a yearly permit and if they plan on using all their camps or having access to all their camps they are just gonna pay for them all for the entire hunting season. Most allow camps a week before to a week after. So Colorado that would be from middle of August to almost end of November, they pretty much control that site. They may come in the week before archery lets say or the first week of archery to place their signs, and set up camp. If someone is there they will usually post their signs and let the people there know that they will be bringing in a camp on this day and they need to move their camp out of the zone by that time. Depending if they still want to send a client there after someone's already been hunting. They will most likely do an inspection of the campsite before placing signs to have a documented record of how the site was before their camp was there to keep from getting fined. It is kind of a crappy deal but that is their money, it would be like a tire guy from one company going to another companies parking lot to fix a tire for a customer. The company that controls the Parking lot isn't gonna allow that especially if they could have performed the work themselves. It can be a crappy deal cause an outfitter isn't gonna pay for a camping spot that is 500 yards from water, in a wide open field, with 0 cover. They do have some pretty good camping spots but in a way they also did pay for them or have worked with the USFS long enough to have a good reputation and earned their spots. If you respect them they should respect you as well, any tin I run into a scenario like this I treat the people as if their my clients. We're all on the same team and all want to benefit each other if we can.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk