Tree Rub-How Recent?

[Harmy]

How recent would people think this rub is?

Rub.jpg (97.49 KiB) Viewed 8954 times

[ElkNut1]

It appears to be a photo that was taken last year! At that time it was that years rub!

ElkNut1

[Harmy]

Photo was taken yesterday. 7/28/12

[Freebird134]

Doesn't look that fresh to me, but it also doesn't look a year old!

[WapitiTalk1]

Remember, elk rub really on two major occasions every year.. First are velvet rubs (which really mess with a lot of inexperienced hunters). Many of these look pretty fresh but if you examine closely, you'll oftentimes see some of the dried, material from the antlers as the bulls knock it off on the tree. These are really, of no interest. Second are rut rubs, which are the ones you're after during SEP in the elk woods. Bullwinkle has made a mess of a small pine or chunk of mature alders in a dominance/challenging display.. Oftentimes, you can see the fresh sap leaking out of the small pine/fir and if you put your nose close, you can even smell the stinky bull that beat the tree up.

[ElkNut1]

OK, it's still a year old rub! (grin)

ElkNut1

[Harmy]

Interesting observations Phantom16. This was an isolated rub and assuming this years rub, I would assume it was a velvet rub as the rut has not started. Upon closeup examination I do not see any evidence of residues from velvet though.

Closeup.jpg (70.41 KiB) Viewed 8938 times

So, I would then assume this was last years rub as I too have seen green ooze from the scuffed bark in years past and this bark is fairly well browned and weathered. Alternatively, maybe this is a few weeks old? Not much other sign present to give me any more clues though.

Following your line of logic, the elk are still very much in velvet right now, right? They should be rubbing to remove velvet late July in earnest, correct? When do they stop rubbing to remove velvet? When the rut begins? Two days ago I saw a HUGE 6X6 in velvet right next to the Jim Bridger Power Plant's I-80 exit outside of Rock Springs , WY, 400 yards off I-80--- I have never seen elk in this desert before. This guy was full velvet.

[eltaco]

Sounds obvious, but the best clue that's usually left to find is any pine branches that have been taken off with the rub. I'm not sure how long they stay green, but if there are twigs with green pine needles lying there, you can bet it's pretty recent

[Swede]

It is not fresh. It is not recent. It is last year's rub.

[Lefty]

Doesn't look that fresh to me, but it also doesn't look a year old!

I would agree
Looks newer since September

[elkohalic]

was there any bark on top of the green grass?

[ElkNut1]

Harmy, that rub is definitely not this years rub! It could have even been rubbed in Nov. thoughThe rub you've shared in the photo is old compared to a fresh one. No elk could rub that this year with the velvet on. When elk start growing their antlers in Spring early Summer with the fresh velvet on them this shows there's blood in the antlers & they are very sensitive to rubbing. Once the blood recedes from the antlers they can become a nuisance or itch at the bulls, in turn they start to shed or rake this velvet off. When this is done you can find remnants of velvet on the ground or clinging to the tree. At times there will be long pieces or shreds as they remove it by raking/rubbing the velvet off. It looks like little hairs!

Look at these photos. The 1st one is a year old rub & the 2nd photo is a much fresher one, it was a new rub at the time of the photo!

ElkNut1

[cnelk]

Here is what velvet looks like clinging to a tree...

[cnelk]

Here is a 'fresh' rub...
You can see the sap on the truck...

This is located in one of my most favorite areas to kill elk...




Here is rub that will really make you slow down and maybe do some 'raking'...
The shredded bark is still flexible and the sap hasnt even stated to ooze yet



Here is a rub that was made in mid-Oct...

[CrazyElkHunter]

Definitely last years rub. No sap, no branches, no fresh velvet, no blood on tree from this years velvet. On another note, it looks like it could even be a deer rub rather than a elk rub from the length and height. Even a small bull would have made a few more nicks and scrapes farther up the tree. Once again, pictures can be deceiving.

[ElkNut1]

Nice photos!!

Harmy, in response to your other question, bulls are ready to breed as soon as they start shedding/raking off velvet! Problem is, the cows generally are not! (grin) The cows run the show, once they approach estrus then the action begins! This is why such Blind/Cold Calling can be successful in early season, you are imitating a cow or cows nearing or in estrus in pre-rut times! The oldest cows in the 7-8 + years will come into estrus 1st, this can & generally happens the last week of Aug & into early Sept. This is not Peak Rut though when the majority of the cows come in & out of estrus! A cow is in heat for 12-15 hours at this time & can be bred 6-10 times during her time!

ElkNut1

[Harmy]

GREAT feedback and photos everyone. This was educational for me. Chris

[dreamingbig]

When will bulls generally start rubbing their velvet off? I know it is in August and I have seen them as early as mid August. What is your experience?

[CrazyElkHunter]

The areas we hunt, all the branched antler bulls will have all velvet off when we arrive in late Aug. The spikes will still be in velvet clear into the 3rd week of Sept. All the deer are still in velvet and start rubbing 2nd and 3rd week in Sept. This can be different from lower mid western states like New Mexico and Arizona's dryer climate compared to more northern states like Montana, Wyoming , Northern Colorado. The guys and gals that live in these states like cnelk, swede and elknut,could probably give you a better answer than I can because my experience is from hunting Aug and Sept only, and do not live in elk country.

[otcWill]

Here's some from last year, the year before andthree years ago. I think they like this spot!! Hope this works, been having trouble posting pics

[cnelk]

Here's some from last year, the year before andthree years ago. I think they like this spot!! Hope this works, been having trouble posting pics

If you use Photobucket to host pics, you will need to size them to post here.
Just click the 'resize' above the pic and use the 400pix x 400pix option

[JohnFitzgerald]

Here's one of the many I found last year.

[dreamingbig]

I didn't find any fresh ones this weekend but I looked pretty hard. I know where the bulls like to bed so I stayed away from those areas for now. I am suspecting that if they were rubbing it was near their bedding areas.

[eltaco]

I went back to a rub from 2yrs ago this weekend. The tree looked like it had died 10yrs ago. It was extremely weathered and bent over. You might ask how I know it was only 2yrs old... my buddy and I walked on the rub which wasn't present two days earlier. We were standing there in awe as we realized there were twigs broken two feet higher than we could reach. Unfortunately, the massive bull was standing 40yds from us watching us as we admired his handy work... we didn't realize it until he busted out of there. That one still stings a bit each time I go back to that tree....