Need some help please.

[archerynut611]

As most of you know, I am new to this site and I am planning my 1st elk hunt. There will be 6 of us going and we are all avid bow hunters so we want to do an archery hunt. None of us have ever been elk hunting before so we decided for our 1st time, we are going to spend the extra money and go with a semi-guided hunt. We all are into the idea of doing the hunting on our own but feel it would better to have some help getting us in and out of camp and to help us retrieve and pack out an elk should we happen to get one. Also to get an idea of what we need to do a hunt on our own in the future.
Can any of you point us in the right direction for a good outfitter that provides semi-guided hunts for a bunch of new comers to elk hunting? We are kinda looking more at Colorado do to the fact that it seems there is more OTC tags available there. After looking online for many hours, I have found that there is a ton of outfitters out there. So now I am completely overwhelmed by all our options for an outfitter. If any of you have any experience with outfitters and wouldnt mind throwing some suggestion out there,it would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Henry

[buglmin]

Youre going to get a lot of different answers here and opinions, so I'll give you one from someone that used to outfit...We never did drop camps, cause if there were elk in an area, and I had a paid client, I was hunting that area. With drop camps, the outfitter dont make a lot of money, especially if he has to ride in to check on you or pack an elk out, so most drop camps are closer then his hunting camps with paying clients. And the drop camps aint in his best area. So, be careful when you talk to outfitters, cause yessir, they do make the hunting sound better then what it is. And a lot of guys will tell you how good the hunting was in such and suchs drop camp, but like I said, if the hunting was that good, I'd be in there with my higher paying client.

[easeup]

well just call up our buddy here, Indian Summer
he is up standing guy, elkoholic and guide. ask him for help.

[Willie makit]

611, I’m looking at my first year for elk as well, one thing to add to Buglman's post is to remember if they pack you way back to a predetermined camp, you are most likely stuck there for your duration. This will limit your mobility somewhat, I have not ruled out going the route you guys are looking at but should I go that route I'm planning to Bivy away from main camp on 1-3 day "loops" around the main camp site. Being mobile is a top theme you will hear about elk hunting since they are so nomadic.

Having 6 noob guys on a first trip should be a truly awesome experience or a freakin nightmare, best wishes and keep us posted.

[archerynut611]

611, I’m looking at my first year for elk as well, one thing to add to Buglman's post is to remember if they pack you way back to a predetermined camp, you are most likely stuck there for your duration. This will limit your mobility somewhat, I have not ruled out going the route you guys are looking at but should I go that route I'm planning to Bivy away from main camp on 1-3 day "loops" around the main camp site. Being mobile is a top theme you will hear about elk hunting since they are so nomadic.

Having 6 noob guys on a first trip should be a truly awesome experience or a freakin nightmare, best wishes and keep us posted.

I agree with the mobility being key. And we actually where talking about bivying away from camp as well. We still got some planning to do and to find a good Gmu to hunt in.
The 6 of us have been friends for quite a few yrs but you are right. This could turn into a night mare.lol

[ElkNut1]

Please define semi guided? Are you referring to a drop camp? That is not a guided hunt, it just means they take you into a predetermined camp & you are on your own from there. With no elk hunting experience at all amongst the 6 of you ( that's toooo many novices in one group) it could turn into a big expensive camping trip. Do some homework guys & DIY is in the cards if you're not going guided! If you guys get an elk down you can pack it out yourselves to your own base camp, horses are not needed. Be prepared physically & have packs that double as daypacks/meat haulers & you guys can do your own packing, these are all purpose lightweight packs. Do not worry about bivy hunting for 2-4 days away from base camp since you've never elk hunted before & there's no one to take the lead.

Are you considering a drop camp because none of you have any camping gear? Have you hunted deer or other animals in the past, can you break down a deer & get it into gamebags, if so you can do an elk, they're just bigger! We need a bit more background on your hunting experience?

What's holding you back from doing a DIY, what are your concerns?

Planning & preparing for an elk hunt is 1/2 the fun & excitement, it builds confidence & enthusiasm for what it will hold.

ElkNut1

[Seminole]

Indian Summer Outfitters is an awesome group to hunt with. Joe runs the cleanest, best run camp I have ever been in and you will have the time of your life. I have hunted with him twice and I have nothing but great things to say about his operation. I hope I can go with him again soon. AAA+

Regardless of your decision, you should at least talk to Joe so you know what you should be looking for. He is a real asset.

[Indian Summer]

With 6 rookie hunters I'm pretty sure not all of them will become lifelong elk hunters. For those guys to buy the gear needed to do what Paul said could be a waste of money. If the hunt is completely unsupervised and doesn't go well that's about guaranteed.

Bugle... did you always have enough guided clients to cover every spot there were elk? If so you had too many hunters, not enough elk, or maybe to small an area? After reading your post I'll have to agree with you... it doesn't sound like a hunter would want to to book any unguided hunts in your neck of the woods. To me every client is important and I plan every hunt 1 at a time. Pretty easy when I only run 6 to 10 in bow and 2 to 6 in gun! If I sent everyone up the hill with the same game plan... or no game plan it would never work.

How smart would it be for an outfitter to put guys in a spot that A) had no elk or B) was really difficult to hunt? Remember... the hunts get reported here & elsewhere on the internet. Bad reviews are like cancer. Also... the idea is to get repeat clients right. 90% of my hunters are repeats. This is the only place I even advertise anymore.

Keep this in mind folks... the Forest Service designates where outfitters can camp. Yes we can make changes from time to time but we can't just camp anywhere. Therefore I have T0NS of places that we can't get to with clients from camp. There are places where I can do drops but not guided hunts. I WISH I could camp and guide there! I guess not all states are the same. I haven't seen an ATV in 13 years.

Here's my plan this season outside Montana.... I tried to book a drop camp in Wyoming but the USFS won't authorize drops in the area I want to hunt. So I'm having the outfitter pack me in with my own gear. I'm a client too! I know a guide who works in the area. He feeds me spots where they see elk... but can't get clients to. I hunt beyond that. I could hike my butt in there but... why should I? I could also trailer livestock down there and do it myself. Pain in the butt! I plan to kill 2 big bulls and that is serious business. There are two of us, one rookie I'm teaching this year, and we'll be pretty far in. A dead elk would mean at least 2-3 days of down time making a 2nd bull a long shot... for a guy who knows what he's doing and has all the gear needed to do it.

A friend down there sent me to a spot last year and it paid right off. All guides and outfitters in a decent area have elk they'll never get to. Well... maybe not all I guess.

The planning and preparing is half the fun. But you'll have plenty to prepare for on our semi guided hunts and our help doing it if you want some. Want to buy all your own gear and just be packed in & out? No problem. Maybe next year you'll decide you don't need me and that's fine too... I'll gladly send you to an area where you won't see a soul and there are good elk numbers. I can't camp there. Neither can any other outfitters. Interestingly I can take lodge hunters there. Most guys here would probably say lodge hunts suck too... gotta camp. But I could give you some reasons why they can be awesome & just as physical as a pack in hunt... maybe more. For starters hunting where me and no other outfitters can camp and locals don't bother. No man's land.

Archerynut I have exactly what you want. Not Colorado but your Montana elk licenses are guaranteed. 0utfitted DIY. AND the dates are great 9/13 to 9/19. Best thing anyone on here can tell you is get the phone numbers of every guided and and guided B0Whunter from last season and see what they say. Last year I had plenty of unguided hunters who saw plenty of bulls and got shot opportunities... I think the number was somewhere around 100%. The amount of clients who saw other hunters was right at 0%. We had one unguided first time elk hunter kill a bull in 6 hours on his first day.

Give me a call and I'll answer any questions you may have & give you those phone numbers. 406-360-5070

Yes folks... a good outfitter CAN provide legitimate services for DIY hunters in quality areas. Especially 1st timers. Does that seem so far fetched

[welka]

Having done all FOUR types (DIY, guided, semi-guided, and drop), your scenario sounds like a perfect fit for a SEMI guided hunt. If you choose to go with a guided or semi-guided trip, you need to talk to others who have used them in the past. You can usually get that type of info from the guide, or better yet, from websites like this and others. Notice I suggested semi for your first hunt and NOT a drop camp. The semi guided option usually gives you a couple of advantages (guides will help you on 1-2 days to get you oriented to the land and point out some potential hot spots, send you in a different direction if the first place didn't pan out, they pack our your meat, cook your food, etc) that would help rookies. Of the many mistakes we made on our initial attempts on our own, DIY out of the blocks was one of our biggest mistakes. It was many years ago and we were not as up to speed as we should have been (i.e didn't have the DVDs and Playbook back then, didn't have enough elk hunting experiences, etc). We wandered looking for elk and elk sign the first few days and then made tons of rookie mistakes. Tried bivy in a wilderness area on our own also. Not a great idea for newbies as a little rain will make you long for the confines of a semi-guided, drop, or lodge hunt. Just way too many things to learn. You should actually consider SEVERAL years with a semi guided option to really give you the best chance for success. The cost is not that much more for the value. DIY can be done, but in my experience and opinion, you need to get some experience under your belt with the help of a reputable guide. Take Joe up on his offer and give him a call even if you plan to go to Colorado. Good luck and make sure you split up into twos/three max when the 6 pack heads out this year!

[Seminole]

Welka: We need to get the crew together and hunt again. Maybe Joe could have room for us in 2014?

[ORelksniper]

Archerynut611, you and your buds are in for one awesome experience, if you do it right. You guys are obviously ready to lay out some cash for this first time elk hunt so why not learn as much as you can for the $$$ spent. There are lots of outfitters to choose from and in that business a man's word and reputation are everything. I don't know Joe (Indian Summer) but if he was just blowin' smoke I'm pretty sure the word would be out. My best advice is take the man up on his offer and have the hunt of your life. Hell, I'd do it myself if I could.

[archerynut611]

Please define semi guided? Are you referring to a drop camp? That is not a guided hunt, it just means they take you into a predetermined camp & you are on your own from there. With no elk hunting experience at all amongst the 6 of you ( that's toooo many novices in one group) it could turn into a big expensive camping trip. Do some homework guys & DIY is in the cards if you're not going guided! If you guys get an elk down you can pack it out yourselves to your own base camp, horses are not needed. Be prepared physically & have packs that double as daypacks/meat haulers & you guys can do your own packing, these are all purpose lightweight packs. Do not worry about bivy hunting for 2-4 days away from base camp since you've never elk hunted before & there's no one to take the lead.

Are you considering a drop camp because none of you have any camping gear? Have you hunted deer or other animals in the past, can you break down a deer & get it into gamebags, if so you can do an elk, they're just bigger! We need a bit more background on your hunting experience?

What's holding you back from doing a DIY, what are your concerns?

Planning & preparing for an elk hunt is 1/2 the fun & excitement, it builds confidence & enthusiasm for what it will hold.

ElkNut1

We are all established bow hunters with multiple deer and turkey kills under our belt. We also process all of our animals ourselves. Our reason for going with a semi guided hunt is to save time so to speak. No, we dont have any of the gear we need to set up our own camp but thats not the issue either. We will have a total of 14 days round trip to do this hunt. 2 days driving, a day to hike to where ever we end up going and to set up camp (guestimation).. So there is 3 days gone. should we happen to get an elk,even though all of us are know how to process the meat and would likely not have a problem getting it done, that would likely still be another 2 days minimum to get it out of the woods so thats now at least 5 days gone. (SHOULD WE HAPPEN TO GET 1) Then another day to pack out and 2 days of driving to get back to NH. Our biggest concern is time. Having as much time as we possibly can to spend hunting. Do we know how to set up a camp? For the most part yes, Do we have all the gear we need to do it? No we do not. Dont get me wrong, The idea of us doing it all our selves is intriguing to all of us and this in no way means that in the future we wont diy. We talked it over and we all seem to be in agreement that due to our lack of knowledge that a semi guided hunt would be a sensible way to go for our 1st time out. This way we will know what we are up against should we decide to do a diy.

From what I have read, a semi guided hunt is in between a drop camp and a guided hunt. The outfitter packs you out to a camp, will help with the camp chores and will help you find and pack out your elk if you shoot one. Then pack you back out at the end of the hunt. You do the actual hunting on your own. They all seem to vary on what they offer for services with a semi guided hunt.

[Indian Summer]

You'll be in WY next year Noah. Welka will be back again this year. I'm sure he & I & Frank will be hunting somewhere again next year too. He's a great gameplanner and his optimism is always great in camp. Every once in awhile he even has a sense of humor. Frank is usually sore by mid week.... from laughing. Even if you are surrounded by elk in WY I bet we'll be having more fun north of you.

Have you broken those Hardscrabble Hikers in yet?